THE PRINCIPAL of Palmer’s College, Mark Vinall has hit back at concerns that only 6% of students at the Chadwell Road college go on to “good” univeristies.
Orsett Conservative councillor, Mike Revell challenged education bosses at Thurrock Council last week over the low numbers of students going to top universities. In 2009-10, no Thurrock student went up to either Oxford or Cambridge and all other stats see Thurrock languishing near the bottom of the league.
The council revealed that of the 520 Palmer’s College students that went to university last year, only 6% went to the Russell group of universities (Edinburgh, Durham, LSE, Exeter, York etc.).
But principal Vinall has written to YT to put their side of the story.
Mr Vinall said: “In this case I feel the young people of Palmer’s have been done a disservice.
We are proud of every student we send to university. For many they will be the first in their family to progress to HE. Whether they progress to Oxford or Cambridge, to a Russell Group university or the one up the road, it is the progression to a potentially life changing educational experience that we celebrate and we must never make those who do not go to the Russell Group feel in any way inadequate. They have not failed and nor has Palmer’s.
It is also worth noting that for many of our students the Russell Group is an inappropriate measure as the top university choice for their chosen subject is not a Russell Group university at all. If we compare the Guardian league tables, for subjects such as Media, Film, some Business courses, Nursing and even Veterinary Science and Dentistry, many or most of the top choices are not in the Russell Group at all.
Also, some of our finest universities are not in the self-selecting Russell Group. To take an example which is clearly not at random, when one of our ex-Grays School students got 39 points on the IB (that’s 589 UCAS points and our best-ever IB score) and went to Durham to study English, she had done phenomenally well and has gone to one of the premier universities in the country if not world. Yet Durham is not in the Russell Group. Nor is York, where we regularly send students to strongly competitive courses as Chemistry, Physics, Maths, Psychology and Philosophy. Admission to a Russell Group university is, at best, a skewed measure of excellence.
Palmer’s College is committed to social inclusion and widening participation and this is entirely compatible with raising aspirations and increasing success. We do not believe that opportunity is restricted by postcode, or that doors are closed to our students that are open to others. We send our students to the universities that are right for them and, of course, we always want them to get the best offer they can that is consistent with their UCAS choices. We never lack ambition for our students. To be criticised for not being elitist enough is shocking. Imagine what criticism we would receive in a few years if the town centre campus is built and we don’t send any students there because they have all gone away to Russell Group universities.
Last year we sent 520 students to university. That’s 520 success stories.
Mr Vinall, please don’t take any notice of our local politicians. They are, by and large, a bunch of incompetents and idiots. My son is in his last year at Palmers and has been offered places in all of the Uni’s he has applied for and one of them is a Russell Group Uni (Leeds). As it happens, it isn’t his first choice but he has been given the opportunity to go there via the excellence of his education at Palmers for which I, as a proud Dad, thank you.
gray64 – you seem to have missed the point of these recent articles/statistics. We are in no way implying that Palmer’s doesn’t offer a good education and that Palmer’s doesn’t send students to universities, just not those deemed “good” universities by official league boards. It is not our local politicians, but a plethora of independent research which determines what the best universities are. Unfortunately, statements like Mr Vinall’s, demean those who do get into these “good universities.”
Just who denotes which university is good and which is not, we are all too bogged down with league tables from Primary schools to Universities, regardless of where you do your further education if you put in the time and effort you will gain good grades; unfortunatley what a lot of universities fail to do is to educate the pupils on the real world as too may graduates seem to think that they will come out of Uni and walk into a high position job, these days are now over and they may need to work from the bottom up.
Abbie Blogger – you have somewhat misinterpreted the point of Mr Vinall’s response which was to celebrate all 520 students who had progressed to HE, not just those that went to the Russell Group (and maybe that YourThurrock have also got it wrong because York and Durham as Mr Vinall explains, are not in the Russell Group; though this is a minor error on their part it shows a lack of understanding. Mr Vinall is very clear in that he celebrated ALL those who go to Oxbridge, other Russell Group universities and all the other universities.
If anything he seems frustrated with people playing politics with the achievements of our young people who he rightly points out have done very well at Palmer’s and are a credit to the borough which should be more proud of them.
Abbie, did you even read Mr Vinall’s piece? You got completely the wrong end of the stick. It was the local politicians who made an issue out of students not getting into good universities, that’s why Mr Vinall was compelled to respond. He also did not in any way demean Russell Group Uni’s, he was merely stating that, for some students, the best course for them is run elsewhere. Abbie, as you responded using the term ‘we’ can I take it that you are one of the local imcompetents to whom I referred in my first post?
It really comes down to poor local education policies, and a lack of focus on social problems, no point asking local people to go to universities they cant afford, and when there are limited jobs for them when they finish to pay those student loans. The conservatives with their savage cuts and the lack of education leadership in Thurrock Council are behind the low aspirations of these young people. Palmers as a college seems one of the better colleges, why are we focusing on this one college? there are wider problems and i don’t hear any real comment from those responsible for education policy in this area on this issue.
Trisca, Poor education policies? Lack of focus on social problems? You must be on Planet Activist! 520 kids going to Uni from one college is pretty darned good if you ask me. If you stop being hysterical about the cost of student loans and actually look at the way they are repaid, they are very reasonable indeed and well affordable for anybody that wants to go. If people like you stopped ranting about how they are all so ‘unaffordable’ and ‘unfair’ then maybe more kids will entertain the idea of going to further education.
gray64 it is not a case of who shouts the loudest. these loans cost a fortune you sound like one of these right wing conservative extremists. A student loan is a debt and we must make sure there are jobs to help our children pay for them. However i do agree with on thing you said to Mr Vinall: ‘ don’t take any notice of our local politicians. They are, by and large, a bunch of incompetents and idiots’. That was a precise and well made point, so at least we agree on something.
Trisca, yes, of course the loan is a debt but it’s collected via tax coding. That means, no job, no repayment. Earnings of £25k a year will mean you paying back around £30 a month or, put it another way, about the cost of a mobile phone contract. Is that really too much? My boy is going to Uni later this year fully understanding the repayments because he took the time to read all the information available and came to the decision that it was affordable. The days are long gone when kids can expect an Uni education for nothing.
gray64 fair comment we all need to contribute to our education. I agree with that. I think it would still be a shame if after a degree our kids find themselves on the dole. but you have a point worth noting. Good luck to your boy in his studies. We have to get these politicians to help create jobs and get this economy moving.